Updated: Thu Nov. 05 2009 3:19:25 PM

CTV.ca News Staff

Conservative MPs, with the support of a few Liberals and New Democrats, have voted in principle to kill the contentious federal long gun registry.

The House erupted in cheers from the Tories as the private member's bill passed by a vote of 164 to 137. The Tories got help from 12 NDP MPs, eight Liberals and one Independent.

Conservative MP Candice Hoeppner's bill will now go to a Commons committee for further study and a possible amendment.

Conservatives have long argued that the decade-old registry for most shotguns and rifles is a colossal waste of taxpayer dollars, which targets honest gun owners while doing nothing to curb gun crime.

However, proponents such as police chiefs, notably from big cities like Montreal and Toronto, have said the registry is useful tool and has lead to more responsible gun ownership and has reduced suicides and crimes of passion using guns.

The Harper government has long opposed the gun registry, brought in by the former Liberal government in response to the killing of 14 women at a Montreal college in 1989. They've long argued that it unfairly hassles honest hunters and owners of long guns, while doing nothing to stop criminals.

Conservatives argue the registry has been "$1-billion boondoggle," although a 2006 study by the auditor general found eliminating the long-gun portion of the registry would only save taxpayers about $3 million a year going forward.

The RCMP has strongly supported keeping the registry alive, and is working on improving problems with the database. There was a 2008 report on the success of the overhaul but Public Safety Minister Peter Van Loan won't release it.

"Canadians don't need another report to know that the long gun registry is very efficient at harassing law-abiding farmers and outdoors enthusiasts, while wasting billions of taxpayer dollars," Van Loan's office said in a release Wednesday.

"They don't need another report to know that the registry does nothing to prevent crime."

The vote comes as the 20th anniversary of the Ecole Polytechnique massacre approaches. The mother of one of those slain Montreal students, who was one of those who campaigned for the creation of the registry, put out a public appeal this week imploring MPs to keep the registry going.

"Shoulder firearms kill just like handguns," Suzanne Laplante-Edward wrote in a published letter.

Montreal's police chief, Yvan Delorme, also pleaded with politicians to keep the registry alive, noting that all the money spent to create it will be wasted if it's eliminated.

"Its existence is essential, primarily for security reasons, but also because the investments already made would be entirely wasted," Delorme said in a rare political statement issued from his office.

"Yes, the registry could be improved, but we consider it an important tool to minimize the risks associated with guns."

Delorme described how, shortly after the 2006 Dawson College shooting, police received a report that another individual had been making similar threats. The registry alerted officers that this person owned several guns -- which officers seized, Delorme said.

Last week, Toronto Police Chief Bill Blair also used the seizure of a huge haul of restricted weapons to defend the beleaguered registry.

"We believe that the gun registry provides police services across this country with the information they need, first of all to help us keep communities safe, and also to keep police officers safe," he told a news conference last Wednesday.

The chief noted that Bill C-391 is "intended to gut the gun registry, and to make it impossible for law enforcement officials to have access to the information, the same type of information, that enabled us to seize these weapons -- and frankly, make our cities safer."

The Conservatives meanwhile launched a publicity blitz in recent weeks to draw support for killing the registry.

They bought radio ads in largely rural areas, stressing the importance of protecting the rural way of life, and urging listeners to flood their MPs with calls and emails to vote for the bill.

With reports from The Canadian Press

Comments are now closed for this story

James
Finally some common sense on the hill. This is the first in a long long line of firearms injustices that have been forced on the Canadians. keep up the good work!

Art in PEI
We register our cars, bikes, pets, and many other things. What is wrong with registering our guns?The police say it is of great use to them. I thought we were "tough on crime"!

Joe Szentirmay
We need to get tough on criminals,and harassing law abiding gun owners is not the way to do it.Do we want to live in a controlled society, or a democratic one?The sooner the registry is history ,the better!

montrealer
way to go Conservatives, another way to alienate yourself in Quebec and other Major cities across the country.YOU HAVE TWO MAJOR POLICE CHIEFS CITING GUN BUSTS BECAUSE OF THE REGISTRY, WHILE IT`S NOT PERFECT, it is better than nothing.Couldn't you make some reasonable changes to make it more flexible. My grandfather was a hunter and turned in his guns because he didn`t want to pay for the license every year, especially since he didn't use them anymore.Scrapping it entirely i think is wrong, but changes need to be made. And could the conservatives stop marketing everything!!! I mean at this rate they should open an office on madison avenue in NYC!!!

King david from the West
First things first I always say... I do believe the travesty of the deranged gunman taking all those lives would have NEVER been prevented by the registry.. I could be wrong,, but I do believe,the assault rifle he used to commit this crime WAS SUPPOSED to be registered AT THAT TIME according to the law. Does that simple fact prove the registry did not work??Don't you think the BILLIONS of dollars would be better spent on such things as background checks on people who buy/own/use/collect, rifles?? The old FAC could easily do that.Look,, the billions could be better spent on health care or the environment or even welfare or EI..

Jeff S.
So here's the math: With the 4 upcoming by-election seats currently empty in the house, there are 304 possible votes. The speaker doesn't vote unless there's a tie, which means there's one less vote at 303. So 152 is the magic number for a majority. The Conservatives have 143 and they've confirmed 8 opposition votes, for a grand total of 151. So they need to secure 1 more vote to make it pass... And there we have one of the most powerful Canadians in the country today, who can decide to axe this colossal waste of money, this product of urban ignorance and fear mongering, and this 14 year old infringement on the rights of law-abiding gun owners.

pistolpete
I think it is a good thing to terminate the registry. Reassign that money to prosecute and jail criminals using guns.

Kevin in Vancouver
We have had over 30 shootings in the lower mainland this year already with over 20 of them fatal. There have been no arrests. How is the gun registry helping police? clearly criminals of the serious type buy guns on the black market or they steal them from gun shops they don't register them. Of course the police would love to keep a record of all gun owners they love lists.What the police would like to be able to do is in the case that someone is shot with a rifle they can go to their registry and question everyone that has a registered firearm in the immediate area.Imagine if this tactic were used against other groups there would be screaming so loud they'd hear it right accross the country..

James from STU
It's about time this goes to a vote again. The long gun registry is a waste of money in a time where there is no money to waste!

Tono
Kill it.A government that allows its residents to bear arms has citizens.A government that disarms its residents has subjects.

my take on this
The National Rifle Association and the Republican Party of America are playing a big role in trying to dismantle the long gun registry in Canada. I'd like to see the right wing Americans look after their own backyard instead of interfering in the affairs of other countries. Right wing Americans think they know what is best for everyone and they need a wake up call in the worst way.

Lane
Three important points must be made here: 1. It is true that long guns are sometimes used to kill people. However, a rifle can be used to kill someone whether it is registered or not. And those owned by criminals are not registered. 2. In the case cited by the Montreal Police Chief, the registry could not have helped much. It might have shown that the individual had registered some rifles, but it could not prove that he was not also in posession of other guns that were not registered. Regardless of whether or not the individual had registered any weapons, the police response had to be the same - Assume he is armed and dangerous, do not trust that he has registered all his weapons, and search his residence thoroughly for illegal weapons. 3. This story is wrong when it says the Toronto Police used the long-gun registry to seize "a huge haul of restricted weapons." Rifles and shotguns are not restricted weapons, and Ms. Hoeppner's proposed bill only deals with the long-gun registry, not the registry for restricted weapons like pistols.

HS
Guns don't kill people...governments kill people.

Jeff
All the example of how the registry has helped, probably just slowed down the responce. If someone is talking about shooting everyone, do you realy need to spend the time looking at the registry to see if that person owns guns?

Tom T
"Last week, Toronto Police Chief Bill Blair also used the seizure of a huge haul of restricted weapons to defend the beleaguered registry" Restriced weapons , not long guns. We're talking about shot guns (duck hunting guns) and hunting rifles. This "huge haul" of restricted guns is exactly the type of gun that the long gun registry has no effect on. Going forward, it would only save 3 million per year?? How about investing this saved 3 million in combating illegal handun smugling. The parents of the slain students should be behind this change, not against it. How much simpler can it be, criminals DO NOT REGISTER THEIR GUNS. If you spent 3 million combating illegal handgun trafficing amongst gangs so many more people would be saved than the rare crazy that shoots someone with his hunting rifle, who would have used a knife anyways had he not had access to a gun.

Gareth
Rural gun owners don't like the registry, but victims of crime and law-enforcement think it's useful and worth keeping. Personally I think this is one inconvenience that gun owners should just put up with. Nobody complains about being expected to register their vehicle for example. It seems to me that if we require registration for motor vehicles then its entirely reasonable that some similar sort of registration should be required for firearms. There's nothing preventing law-abiding private citizens owning either, but it makes sense for the government to attempt to keep track of potentially dangerous things like that.

some guy
guns dont kill people.....people kill people.that being said, people have to register their cars, why not a weapon? and why destroy the current information which has been gathered? The concept is a good idea, it simply needs to be modified so that it can acheive its intended goal. if you throw it all away, then it becomes a complet waste of money. Instead they could just change it and salvage what they can and make the best use of the information already amassed.

Jon in London ON
It's time. Kill the long gun registry. The Liberals burned us with it for the $1 billion, and the $3 million per year to be saved when it is gone sounds okay to me.

Don Michaels
Something that I don't see in these news stories is the fact that the long gun registry has not been kept up to date since 2006. So how can it be so valuable to police? Secondly it is akin to having data base at an individual level for long gun owners similar to having people on a sexual predatory list. Are we saying that long gun owners are as dangerous as sexual predators? Police will always opt for any tool that will give them unfettered access to a data base of people. If they could have a database of marijuana offenders I am sure they would support that to inspite of the dubious benefits of having such a resource. The lon gun registry allows police to enter homes of owners, without any warrant, to "check if the long guns are properly stored". This is an abuse of the privacy rights of long gun owners. I really think that Canadians have been bullied into the long gun registry and all that it entails by people who have no interest in long guns who say "if you oppose the long gun registry then you support violence against women, children, or whoever". It is time to end resourcing this in favour of funding more police with fewer powers. It gives the general population AND police a false sense of security and long gun owners pay the price with the sacrifice of their privacy rights.

David from Dartmouth
Shut it down.....NOW!!!While the loss of those students at the hands of a mentally challenged individual... the result would have been the same even with the gun registry!Rural Canada has different needs.Take a look at the increase of Bear traffic showing up in areas they have never been before.Look at the young Lady mauled by 2 coyotes last week..... This is as a result of an explosion in wildlife population, that has not been hunted for years.My brother who lives near Sault Ste Marie, cannot go outside his home without fear of a bear...or bears....or Timber Wolf lurking in his yard.Is is justified to make him a criminal because he requires the use of such a device to protect his life and the lives of his family?......NOT!!!!

Mike Webster, Mississauga
Actually, they need only 10 opposition votes because: 1) there are 4 vacancies in the house meaning that it only needs a bare minimum of 153 votes to pass. That assumes that everyone is present for the vote and nobody abstains. This should more than likely pass given than the Liberals and NDP have agreed to make it a free vote for their members and at least 14 Liberal and NDP members are on record supporting the bill. This is long overdue. As shown by the auditor general, nobody has been able to point to a single solitary case where this has solved a crime or prevented a crime. Indeed, forcing the registration of non-restricted firearms only targets the law abiding gun owners because criminals don't register. The registry doesn't necessarily tell police that there are firearms in a residence because with non-restricted firearms, you can lawfully loan them to another license holder and you do not have to store them at your primary residence. Even OPP commissioner Julian Fantino as been quoted as saying that in his entire police career, he's not aware of a single solitary case that was solved or prevented through the use of the registry. It's an expensive boondoggle that accomplishes nothing and it must go.

Raymond
This abhorrent infringement on privacy should have died long ago.Window dressing for gun-control advocates.Meaningless paper tiger for criminals.Intrusive and expensive monstrosity for gun owners and taxpayers.Less government = more freedom.Bravo.

Bosco
The point is this, this was put forward by the Liberals, Allan Rock, to reduce gun crime. It was supposed to cost $2 million dollars and is now up over $3 Billion (with a "B"). Gun crime has not been reduced one bit. This isn't about rural vs urban or liberal vs conservative, it is about $3 Billion wasted tax dollars with the streets not being any safer. It is a black hole. Lets start targeting criminals, nobody, liberal or conservative would complain about spending money on that.

ProudNBer
To Art in PEI;I would have no problem registering any gun if it was simple as registering a car or a pet, but the red tape involved is beyond belief. I am not a gun owner, but my wife took possession of her fathers hunting rifle on his death and to get all the permits necessary took what seemed like a year. And by the time she got her last permit, her possession one had expired and she had to reapply... what a waste of money.

Trevor
The gun registry has WAY to many flaws and has been hacked many times and guess what that makes it..... a HUGE shopping list for criminals!!! This needs to go and go NOW!

Brenda
Get rid of the registry! For those of us who are law abiding hunters, we already have a license to hunt - which obviously means we have guns. Hand guns and restricted weapons would still have to be registered, not long guns for hunting. Hand guns have been registered since the 1930s....yet they are still used in crime.

candu
So, just because it 'only' costs 3 mil a year, we should keep it going? When does the waste end? So far, I haven't see how this registry helps police when all it is is a list of lawful gun owners. Its human nature and highly political to justify "lists", it shows that "something" is being done, even if it is useless. Maybe we should go back to good old fashioned police work to get illegal guns off the streets. Harassing registered gun owners to see if they made a paperwork mistake doesn't stop criminals.

Doug in Dartmouth
It would be nice to know two things: (a) How many times per year do Police Officers access the Registry and (b) How many of theses calls to the Registry result in information useful to their investigation. That would be the true test. In other words, are officers wasting their time calling the Registry, when their efforts could be directed elsewhere. I suspect, if the Registry was a valuable tool for Police, their would be a greater outcry about the proposed Bill.

Nolan Moore
As many have said, the registry just tells that a person "MAY" have a gun in the house. What was the purpose of the law, to help fight crime. How does having law abiding citizens register their hunting rifle fight crime? It doesn't. Out of all the murders, injuries, etc caused by long guns, most werent' registered. Spend money on back ground checks. With the FAC you know if someone has a gun or can own one, if they are involved in a violent crime, take it away and sieze their firearms.

charlie
The Gun Registry was a quinessential Liberal smoke and mirrors effort to look tough on "crime" (read all gun owners, who in the Liberal mind-set are somehow suspect, of something) while accomplishing essentially nothing,creating a huge amount of cost to taxpayers, and allowing the government at the time to pander to many womens' groups who seemed to think that every man with a gun was an immediate threat to their safety. Alan Rock, pontificating on how the registry would save lives, cut crime, stop spousal violence, etc. was laughable, but he was playing to public sentiment and special interests after the Montreal school shootings (a terrible tragedy, but one where the registry, had it been in force, would have accomplished nothing). His performance was pathetic - but he would not be convinced that his great stance was flawed - an example "when you are wrong, shout louder" - maybe you can drown out reasonable objection!. So, putting the Gun Registry to a vote and tying it to the kiddie porn bill, assured it would pass over any logical objections (after all, who wanted to be painted as being soft on kiddie porn?). Time to kill this mess once and for all - and remember, the passage of this bill does nothing to the requirements for acciquisition certificates, restricted and prohibited classes of weapons, rights to possess handguns, safety training etc. - it only gets rid of a flawed piece of legislation which has cost taxpeyers dearly, does not accomplish its intent and essentially serves daily as a reminder of the vanity of some members of the then government - even the remaining Liberals should support repeal.

John in Sask
I think the wording "long guns" is missused! Any fully automatic weapon should be banned and all pistols continue to be registured or banned. Normal hunting rifles and shotguns are not anymore dangerous than a kitchen knife. By the way, I don't own any gun other than a grease gun so I have nothing to gain by my comments.

allanbritney
Yes lets finally scrap the lame duck gun registry!There are many ways the money could be better spent on behalf of Canadian taxpayers.Perhaps funding the investigation of RCMP members who assault unarmed civilians with deadly weapons such as "Tasers" would be one good use of the money.

No problem having a license and registry
"Tough on crime ... unless we need to pander to some whiners for votes, then we'll gladly throw the baby out with the bathwater." - Stevie.The issue should be how to control budgets and expenditures not the idea of tracking who in this country legally owns firearms - the latter should be a no-brainer but it seems the rifle-owners are the no-brainers.

Vince
The Gun registrery was stupid, is stupid and will be stupid.The Police chief needs to get his facts straight. I have registered all my firearms since the FAC came into affect in the 70's. It was a way to further bother only innocent people. The only way the police were notified about a Potential person, was that the information would already be in the system, and the old FAC got gobbled up in the gun registrey goofiness.The 300 million was simply an attempt to make it look not so costly. The huge line ups, to enter the info, and all the new computing power etc. was not for a few long gun people. Did you see any gang members registery guns. Do all people make threats, or as they saw in Finland, most often by the time someone reads the threats it is too late. Are we going to have a law next that every person's email, blog etc is proof read.That's like saying a seat on an airline flight should only cost as much and the seat it self cost to make. It a goofy reasoning, and doesn't take into account all the other costs, which are needed to make the small seat get to where it is going.The back ground checks, the recording of gun & ammo purchases were already going on in the FAC days. They just used these 14 female victims as Poster children for their aims.

Trent
A list of gun owners does not stop a crime with a gun. A list is just that, and expensive list that does nothing. Any police officer in a non-political role will tell you that the registry is useless and they never depend on its information. The reason is obvious, most crimes are committed with stolen or smuggled firearms. If the suspect is not in the system as a gun owner, how can the registry ever hel?. Besides, police ALWAYS approach a situation as if someone is armed. They do not change their approach depending on what a computer tells them.

Fred - Brandon MB
1. Criminals don't use long guns, hunters do.2. Criminals won't register their stolen/smuggled handguns3. The gun registry didn't prevent the Dawson College shooting, or any other high profile shooting you can think of.4. the gun registry simply makes criminals of otherwise law abiding citizens because they refuse to register their hunting rifles5. haven't we wasted enough money on this issue?

Vince M
I always love the "We register our cars, bikes, pets, and many other things" argument. All those things are your property. Property rights are the consitiutional responsibility of provincial governments. Can you think of any of those things that are registered with the Federal Government? The Gun Registry was a massive trampling of provincial property rights under the guise of public safety.

Saskatchewan father of three
Plain and simple, register gun owners not the long guns and always remember that when the police start making the laws you then have a police state!

Gord in Calgary
Aside from the wasted tax dollars, there are greater reasons to dispose of this draconian misuse of power. History has proven that registration ultimately leads to confiscation and the loss of governmental control by its people. Firearm registration isn't about saving lives or disarming criminals, it's about control. I challenge you to show me where registration and confiscation has reduced violent crime. Both the UK and Australia have seen increases in violent crime since they forced severe gun control laws on their people. Both of these countries also have tight control on their subjects. Where as in the U.S., states which allow licensed concealed carry of a firearm have seen reduced violent crime. These are facts, not made up lies from Wendy Cukier’s Coalition for Gun Control. I believe support for the registry stems from ignorance, fear, and propaganda by those who support greater control over the citizens of our nation.

Vince M
Did any of you actually understand that we had a Firearms Control Certificate in place when the Registry started? You needed one of those to buy a gun. You got it after an RCMP background check and going to the police station for an interview prior to picking it up. With it you could buy a rifle but not a handgun. It has always been near impossible to legally acquire a handgun in Canada. You would think we had no controls in place before Alan Rock introduced this boondoggle.

Dayton
Sorry for the 14 women in Montreal, the 3 officers in Alberta and the 2 officers in Saskatchewan. The problem is the registry would not have helped anyone of them. Shooters don't really care if the gun is registered or not.

Steve
I would like to point out that people need to register their cars to provide more tax revenue to the provinces, registering vehicles has nothing to do with safety. That's what safety inspections in some provinces are for.

sc
For those who keep comparing the registering of a firearm to that of a vehicle, please stop. It is not the same thing. The money collected from a vehicle registration supposedly goes to the upkeep of our transportation system -- in other words, there is a reason for collecting the money. It has a side benefit of keeping track of an item that usually has a high value. The gun registry is a money grab, plain and simple. There is no benefit to it in preventing crime, only in tracking down the registered owner of a gun used in a crime. And as mentioned over and over, if somebody plans to commit a crime, they simply do not use a gun that is registered in their name.

Norman in Calgary
The long gun registry has made criminals out of farmers and trappers. It certainly hasn't stopped the real criminals from getting weapons. That a police chief argues for long gun registry after the capture of restricted weapons is a red herring. Restricted weapons are handguns and not much else. Assault weapons like M16, M14, AK 47s are forbidden/banned. Marc Lepine used a Ruger M 14 which is really an assault rifle that doesn't look like one. The M14 is now a banned weapon. Most assault rifles are semi-automatic. The Mayerthorp RCMP massacre was done with an illegal HK assault rifle smuggled in from the USA by a known crook and cop hater. A lot of hunting rifles are semi-automatic as well. One squeeze = one shot. The difference is in restricting the magazines to 5 shots or less. Military weapons have 20 to 40 round magazines or more. You get caught with these and see what happens to your PAL(permit to acquire and license).These are a far cry from the average farmer, trappers or hunters 3 to 5 shot bolt action rifle or the sporting clays or duck/goose hunters two shot double barrel or 3 shot plugged semi-auto or pump.The licensing process is extremely invasive. It is easier to get a passport or a mortgage.The 250 page manual is very poorly written. The licensing questions seem primarily designed to protect police rather than the public. Yes guns kill that is what they are meant to do. The real issue is responsible use of firearms by responsible people versus a false sense of security created by declaring yourself a peanut free zone with a billion dollar plus peanut registry. The nuts and crooks will always find a way to get their peanuts.

ezkmo
This makes a lot of senses, billions of wasted dollars, and nothing to back up the fact that anything good ever came out of this.let's scrap it and put those founds into health care or something we really need instead.Go Hoeppner Go...

T in C
Not only is the gun registry ineffective, it's inefficient too. I don't understand why some police forces are supporting the gun registry. Why aren't ALL the police forces clamoring to receive the money that is being wasted annual on the gun registry? I'm pretty sure the police can spend the money with better results.Oh, and it's about time there was a 'free' vote on something in Parliament...or as free as a vote can get in a party system.

Ross in Burlington
The Auditor General said this will "only" save the taxpayers 3 million a year going forward. HELLO thank you very much for saving us 3 million. I guess I am too poor to use the word only in front of 3 million dollars, after all I am just a poor retired taxpayer. This should never had happened 10 years ago, the idea is to crackdown on criminals who use guns not duck hunters and farmers. The P.C. Gov. is doing the right thing.

Jamie
I am a 28 year old female and a gun owner and I can say that the gun registry does not harrass me in anyway shape or form. It has its uses and yes it could stand to be revamped. I would be rather upset if the government scrapped the project after all the money they put towards the system.

Pete
Criminals of Canada rejoice! You won't have to register your guns anymore.....

Jim
I'm 60 and grew up on a farm. In those days, incidents of thieves stealing from farmer's yards were very rare.Now, it has become far more common. In fact, some rural folks have been attacked, vandalized, robbed and even killed and many have come to believe they are no longer secure in their homes or yards.I think the gun registry and gun laws are the main reason for this change. Years ago, any would-be thief or vandal knew that every farmer could have a gun or two, and if they got caught in the act on the farmer's place they could get shot at. This was enough to keep most of them away. (Thieves and vandals are really cowards - they pick on the easy or defenseless targets).In the past years, however, these thieves have become more emboldened in rural areas. They know if the farmer even catches them he can't even point his gun without big legal risk. Plus, if he even has a gun it should be locked away and slow to get to. If it isn't, or isn't registered, the farmer will likely be charged with a more serious charge that the thief or vandal.I feel we need to go back to the way it was. Just the knowledge that farmers and acreage owners may have a gun to defend themselves and their property will help keep the culprits away. Besides, the rural person can't usually wait for 30 minutes or more for the police to arrive.

Jim F from North Bay
Finally a victory for Mainstream Canada!

Erika N - Petawawa ON
Finally. It's great that mainstream Canada will no longer be dictated to by the bleeding-hearts in the big city downtowns, who try to put the blame on law-abiding hunters and farmers, instead of looking at their own backyard and doing something to clean up crime in certain segments of the population.

Deseronto_Dan
Great for the Conservatives for following up on another election promise. It is good to see some comments from non-gun owners supporting scrapping this huge waste of money. Anyone who believed this gun registry was a good idea at the start should be really angry at the Liberals and anti-gun lobbyists for lying to them. The rest of us always knew this was a bad idea. Windowdressing all along!

B. Kelley, Ontario
Am I dreaming? A political party is actually trying to repeal a bad law? My God, if this establishes a trend we might actually get back to the point where the government doesn't tell us everything that we must do, think, not do, not think, say and not say. Life with fewer statutory regulations. Do you think that we could actually remember how to make a personal decision anymore without being instructed by the liberal left??

Thinking it through
The fact no one is stating here is that if you legally purchase any weapon in Canada it ALREADY gets logged in a database police have access to. Creating a new "extra special list" with stronger wording does nothing that isn't already being achieved. Only a Liberal could have thought somehow this paperwork would affect criminals on the street...

B. Lewis
The long-gun registry has not been proved to have saved a single life in Canada. Ordinary street level police officers know full well that street gangs access black market weapons regardless of gun laws or gun bans in force. Ordinary street cops are never allowed to voice their true feelings on the registry which most of them agree is useless as a crime fighting tool. Of course the top brass who hob knob with the anti-gun political crowd and with the Coalition for Gun Control will support the registry. By 2012, 2 billion dollars will have been wasted on the registry and Canadians are no more safer now then they were prior to long-gun registration. That 2 billion wasted dollars drained from the wallets of taxpayers could have been used to hire more police and more policing to fight real street gang violent crime and fight the illegal drug trade. Those Chiefs of Police and politicians who support the registry just don't get it. It's a costly failed sinkhole. Scrap it and scrap it now.

Ron Good
Art in PEI wrote: "I thought we were "tough on crime"!"----------------------------------Being tough on crime is not a good reason to be tough on non-criminals. Law-abiding citizens don't deserve to lose their privacy because you might be scared or because police likes things convenient.

Barb Chase Bull Lake NB
Why do people who live in rural communities have the same long gun law as do people in the cities,I think they still should regarister hand gun no matter where they live.come on people get real crimes are done just the same as before if its so good why can police go right to the person who commited the crime.

TMahon
When I read about police who are instruments of the state attempting to sway the decisions of the state, I become gravely concerned. The Gun Registry was the first step in the slippery slope of removing our rights and freedoms and we have lost many since. Finally the Conservative Government is keeping its promise to eliminate it. This is a day to celebrate.

A.J.L.
Registration of legal long-guns in the UK and Australia guaranteed that previously legal guns would be rounded up when the governments of the UK and Australia went after legal owners and banned many types of sporting arms on a huge scale in the mid-1990's. Criminals in the UK and Australia still have their black market un-registered weapons and gun crime still remains the same if not higher.Don't be fooled by anti-gun government statistics that suggest the gun round up and buy back saved lives. Total hogwash. Anti-gun politicians will fudge figures to justify their costly failed schemes to disarm the populace. It's not about crime control and safety, it's about disarming. Registration means confiscation.

Adam in Ottawa
Listen to the cry of the right wing gun nuts! I personally have no issue with people owning firearms, but of course they should ALL be registered. If you don't want to pay for the license, get rid of your gun! You can't drive a car without a license, why do you think you should be able to own/operate a rifle without one. Typical Conservative idiocy and arrogance, the "we didn't come up with it, so let's get rid of it" attitude of King Harper and his cronies is sickening. They could have modified the registry to address it's shortcomings and implemented these changes quite easily instead of trying to scrap it! It boggles the mind...

Toby
"They've long argued that it unfairly hassles honest hunters and owners of long guns, while doing nothing to stop criminals."Yeah right - I live in rural Ontario and these "honest hunters and owners" have the mentality - I can do what I want. Many pay no attention to the rules. If there was a murder in our area and the police asked why did you not call 911 when you heard the gun shots, all I could say is why - we hear these yahoos 365 days a years. And no these are not farmers protecting there livestock.Oh and by the way these yahoos are the same ones that trespass on everyone's property and only have 2 words in there vocabulary which are unprintable.If you want to own a gun, then it should be registered.

To ART in PEI
Hey Art in PEI, since when do gangs register their guns? How nice we have a system that registers guns for the heck of it. If it was proved to me by the police that it reduced even 1% of serious crime, I'd be all for it. As of yet, I have yet to see any reduction in violent crime. Can you imagine if we spent 1 Billion dollars on extra police enforcement? Catching gun smuggling with that 1 BIllion? Do I sense a lost opportunity here? I think some computer programmers and IT professionals during the liberal tendure made a LOT of money creating a useless system while the criminals were laughing all the way to the bank..... pardon the pun...

SK Doctor
I hope it passes so that the government can leave me alone...

Kevin, Ottawa
Yes, let us watch the hypocrites who call themselves the "law and order" party dismantle another useful tool of those that enforce the laws. I remember the Montreal Massacre vividly. Anything that helps us prevent that is worth a little inconvenience.

Gregory D
HI every one I have a problem with some of the arguments in regard to registering fire arms. "Like you have to register your vehicle then why not your gun." There are probably more deaths caused by knives than guns in Toronto. So why not register knives or for that matter why not register base ball bats in case they are used to kill some one. These arguments are ludicrous. I read in the news awhile ago how the police did a blitz by going to registered gun owners and checking their weapons. They used the registry to do it. There was no crime committed they just randomly went to gun owners to check on storage. Now how is this going to stop crime. I also do not think the police should be publicly trying to sway public opinion. They work for the government and should enforce the law. Leave the policy to their bosses. It is fine to have their input in drafting police related policy but it is not their job to sell it to the public. They are acting like lobbyists.

David in Calgary
Here's an idea - why not register the people buying the guns, rather than the guns themselves? Anyone who buys a gun should have to undergo mandatory psychological testing. Yes, the majority of people buying guns may well be innocent and only intend to use them for hunting - but it comes back to the old truth that guns don't kill people, people kill people.

Portes
As a Veteran I hate guns of any kind. After I was discharged I vowed never to own another firearm and have not done so. However having said that I think that the gun registry was a waste of money, it could have been used to put more police on the streets etc. The guns that are killing people are not registered anyway, they are illegal and come across the border from the US. If some of that money had been used to stop the gun trade we would be a lot better off. I have a question, Has it worked in Toronto?

john
This is ridiculus, or else see what is happening in countrys like the Dominican Republic where no one know who has a gun. and the killings, hand gun robberies , drug related killings have risen more than 2000% in the last 10 years. Is this what we need in Canada . Do we need to go from one of the safest countries to USA2 ? or perhaps the gun industry here is too powerful to rechape the constitution to their own good. Please keep this in mind for next election perhaps the conservatives need a lesson. Do not vote Conservative show them who rules here.

Jeff in Halifax
Maybe if we double the minimum time a criminal gets if they use a gun in a crime.This registry will never stop violence in the home because registered or not if your going to shoot someone it doesn't matter.I say save the billions and put it into hiring more police officers and helping victims of crime.

Jonah
$1 billion dollars + $3 million each year.

Now is the time to end this boondoggle.

Divert the money spent on the registry to adding more resources to stem the flow of illegal guns from crossing the Canada/US border by hiring additional police constables and border services agents.

Nov 4 comment
I am so mad at this.Little stevie blunder will probably be singing 'Happiness is a Warm Gun" next year at the NAC with a duet with hoeppner. Long Guns kill people. Long Guns kill people. Why is it so much trouble to fill in a form when you have a gun? A gun is a dangerous weapon for crying out loud. Please put pressure on your MP to vote against this legislation. the Conservatives:wrong on the gun registrywrong on foreign aidwrong on Afghanistanwrong on Immigration. wrong on the environment. Just plain wrong!

duck
I am a long gun owner. I do not think the registry is of much value howeverwhat is good is the fact that firearms owners do need to have a Posession only lisence or a posession aquisition lisence. Those two pieces of identification would be of as much value to the police as a long gun registry. The police would know there are guns at a residenceand exercise caution. That does not nor will it ever solve the problem of illegal ownership of firearms of any sort. Criminals are still criminals and will not register firearms or obtain a POL or a PAL.

JD in Montreal
typical red neck mentality! "uhh, guns make my family safe from those gosh darn terrorists" GOD! can this government do ANYTHING right?! their just asking for more school shootings to happen...watch! yes, it was a bit outdated, but instead of getting rid of it, FIX IT UP!! honestly, this government has gone WAY to far.

SK Doctor
Let freedom reign!

cam, belleville ,ont
We are getting more like the loons in the states by the day.Letting minorities dictate public policy because they make the most racket.And yes gun owners you are the minority when considering the overall population.Going to be a many red faced politicians carrying a lot of guilt when (not if) the next gun slaughter happens.

Roger in Winnipeg
I guess I can finally now get my guns out of storage where they've been sitting since this nonsense started, totally unregistered, I might add, and free of stupid bar code stickers, etc.It's time to go moose hunting!

Jeff
Finally. This registry doesn't do anything to curb gun violence and is a waste of money. Guns can still be used criminally whether they're registered or not. And gun violence is committed with illegally imported guns from the states, guns that can be concealed. Not hunting rifles and shotguns. People are already required to take a course to get a firearms acquisition licence, and were required to do so before this registry was initiated. Controlled "collectors" guns were also required to be registered anyways. Those regulations are enough. Your average Joe has never been able to just walk into a store and just buy a gun, at least not in recent times.

Manitoba Gurl
This awesome news! Another tick in the good box for the Conservatives. Just as they promised. Finally, the innocent people living in rural areas that use long guns for hunting purposes will not be penalized.

John E
You just can't beat the NRA. They just have too much influence and money and can easily manipulate the weak minded Canadian into thinking the Gun Registry is useless. It is not. It was poorly implemented by stupid bureaucrats, but it was an excellent tool to help police. We really missed a golden opportunity here and the next officer to fall because of unknown long guns, I hope the family sues the government for every cent they can get.

Wayne in Winnipeg
Yes ... kill the registry. It is an infringement on the rights of law abiding gun owners while the law breakers go unfettered.What is still a wonderment is that there has been no accounting for the $2 Billion 'set up' fees. Where did this money go? Fingers pointed at a complex computer model. huh? That sounds more like a trial run of how to do 'adscam'. About the same time the Ministry of manpower 'lost' $1 billion. This money was AWOL. There still has been no accounting for that $1Billion. Another trial run of the adscam millions.And then there was adscam itself. Fingers caught in the 'pork' cookie jar.Where is all the money, Mr. Chretein? "Well, you know .......bs".

Jason
Guns don't kill people, people kill people. The program was a waste of tax payer dollars. If you want to make communities/cities safter, use the money saved to improve the security at points of entry to Canada where many of the smaller more widley used guns cross the border.

len
Law enforcement are almost unanimous on the value the registry has in preventing crime.Yet the flat earthers continue to mouth idiotic talking points.One thing you can say about the neocon ideologues.They never let facts get in the way their rants.

CJ in Korea
Finally some good news. The long gun registry is NOT a tool that police often use. To insinuate that the Toronto Police use it regularly is a gross exaggeration of the truth. The majority of guns used in crimes are unregistered and are on the streets because of the illicit drug trade between US and Canada. Toronto cops and the Lieberals need to get their heads to planet Earth.Steven Harper.... you made my day. Thank you :)

Goldens
Y E A H!, yeah!, yeah!, yeah!, Y E A H! John W Bridgetown NS

Bob in Harley
Common sense prevails! Criminals do not register guns. Requiring gun owners to take a safety course before obtaining a gun makes sense but to register a gun a huge waste of money. Those same Chiefs of police would have you register far more than your guns if they had their way. We need a common sense balance not big brother breathing down our necks.

allan
I am happy to see some common sense beginning to be used. If the gun registry does nothing to save lives, why would we waste money on it? Just to have a nice buzz word called the "gun registry" does nothing to help crime deterrence.

Roland Lewis
Listen to the whining anti-gun nuts who ramble on about how the sky is going to fall if the long gun registry is dismantled. Sorry to burst your bubble but I say good riddance to this useless and wasteful legislation when it finally gets wiped off the slate. To all you anti-gun nuts, there is still is a very restrictive and intrusive licence system that legal gun owners are required to have to possess a sporting arm. A long-gun registry is no more effective in preventing black market gun crime then the handgun registry is. Criminals get guns outside of the law, they always have and they always will but a legitimate owner still needs a Firearms Licence if stopped by police and found in possession of a gun. No licence and you will be arrested whether a gun is registered or not.It is truly amazing that the anti-gun lobby actually believes that a two billion dollar long-gun registry saved lives. What it really boils down to is that subsidized groups like the Coalition for Gun Control have finally been blocked in their quest to have all civilian sporting arm owners disarmed.The cat is out of the bag and the truth is out. The long gun registry is a complete and utter failure and clear thinking Canadians have woken up to this fact. Hats off to the Conservatives.

Brian
Finally!!!!A victory for common sense in this country.Gangbangers and would-be criminals don't use bolt action hunting rifles to hold up stores or execute one another in their turf wars, they use pistols, sub-machine guns and assault rifles - firearms.It's not like the crooks are lined up to register their illegal weapons, and the legal firearms aren't typically used in crimes.FINALLY, our politicians have seen the light and realized that penalizing legal gun owners with a registry for their guns does not somehow magically empower Police divining rods where all the illegal guns are being smuggled and kept.What's utterly sad is the amount of money completely wasted on this failed idea. Retail stores big and small across this country have wedding registries - and it didn't cost them billions to set up. How come a gun registry, no matter how irrelevant couldn't be set up for far cheaper? Surely it's a testament to poor governance and a propensity to waste tax payers money on programs that have absolutely no hope whatsoever of accomplishing what they are advertised to resolve when their own design prevents them from succeeding. Celebrate this victory folks!!!

Adam
I am a firearms owner. My guns should be and are registered. What a waste of money if the registry is abandoned. This is a useful tool for police. What is the issue with having something that can kill people registered!

david sawkiw[saskatchewan farmer]
To a lot of Westerners this is good news, I for one will definately vote CONSERVATIVE in the next election AND I would like to personally thank the 12 ndp and 8 liberals who returned our democracy back into a true democracy, today, I am once again PROUD of our Ottawa politicians!!However,, I do feel sorry for the people who are disappointed by this vote,, I truly believe that if Toronto Montreal, or any other city really want a registry they should have one. Lobby your mayor.Lobby your provincial governments...

the old lady
You folks are right Guns do not kill people , people kill people.If I am stupid and mean enough to kill someone it will matter not if my gun is registered. I will just go and shoot you. Most domestic violence killings the person just shoots their partner and registering the gun will not stop this. Gangs do not care about the law so why do you think they will register what they shoot one another with. Stupid Stuoid dumb law just a money grab.Get rid of it post haste.

Paul
O.K. Since when have the criminals been forced to register their gun's hmm, never.

Honest citizens do or they become criminals.

Since when does a criminal have to be a licensed gun owner to own gun's never.

Honest citizens are obliged to be licensed and registered.

Since when does a criminal have to take a firearms course, HMm never.

Honest citizens do, before they become licensed.

Moral of the story, gun laws only affect honest citizens, they have no affect on criminals. Wake up and smell the roses, at least the Conservatives have.

arnie Williamson
At last common senseJust because we own something does not automatically mean we register it. In plan fact more people are killed in ladder accidents every year than with fire arms yet we see no huge cry.We register pets to pay the cost of housing and retrieveing problem animals or animals no one wants.Vehicle registration allows us to trace the ownership of a vhicle and it's safety record on the road over time as well as return it to the owner when stolen. There is also broad public appeal for this to happen both urban and rural.What we have here is an illegalhand gun and assault rifle problem being unfairly used to penialize legitiamate owners of fire arms.The bad guys are not going to walk in and register thier guns.

David in Van
The registry is useless and so are its proponents.

I'll be very glad when it's finally gone.

Expat
After reading this I am so glad I chose to move out of Canada. What happened to Canada? I grew up in urban Vancouver but spent my working career in rural BC before moving out of the country. I can't see ever moving back because of the clossal shift to the right we as a country keep taking. How bloody hard is it to register a gun? I had a girlfriend whose father had about seven or so rifles just sitting out in the open in his basemant. He was appalled that I suggested he register them. He didn't even hunt anymore. I have always said that we get the government we deserve, and guess what Canada, you got it.

Darwin Lepine
Finaly some common sense from Ottawa. The gun registry in Canada infringes on my rights as an aboriginal to practice my right to hunt under section 35 of the Canadian Charter Of Rights & Freedoms. The Charter is the supreme law of Canada, any act that infringes on any section of the charter is there by null and void.

Steve G
The Association Of Police Chiefs are in favour of maintaining the registry---That's good enough for me!I'll put my faith in them over the spin being produced by the Conservatives/Gun Lobbyists.Judging by the preponderance of Conservative operatives posting here, I am predicting a 1:5 ratio of thumbs up-to-thumbs down response to this post however.

Nov 4 comment
For anybody who wants to stops this travestry please visit the coalition for gun control and read their information. I am not associated with this site but this is the place to start. We have to target individual MP's beginning with hoeppner.Please note that any deduction to this group is NOT tax deductable but any contribution to harper or hoeppner is tax deductable at politically contribution rates because they actually stand for something. That's right if someone is opposed to the gun registry they do not the financial advantage that neo-cons have donating to hoeppner and harper for this tripe. But do it anyway you'll feel better and it is the right thing to do.

Henry Wysmulek
Worst piece of garbage law in Canadian history. It only Demonize’s and turns law abiding Canadians into criminals, while allowing criminals to run amok shooting people unchecked!The people that drafted this registry law should be thrown in jail for aiding and abetting criminals!Now they can get down to going after the real criminals!

Eileen
While I oppose the abolishment of the gun registry, it is the only issue MP Cheryl Gallant of Renfrew Nippissing Pembroke ever focused on, despite representing the riding in which both AECL and CFB Petawawa are located. Perhaps now the constituents of the riding will pay attention to what is really going on.

james ottawa
Whatever happened to the right to a safe and secure life? Imagine the latest violent home invasion while your firearm is trigger locked in a vault in a locked room as per the law. That is fine for safe storage to protect from theft or children which is your responsibility. But when that home invasion happens, or there is chaos in the streets because there is no Federal Emergency Plan, let's hope your home phone or cellular works to call 911. The most lax gun laws in the U.S.? Vermont. Lowest violent crime rate, Vermont. I remember the quick legislation when there was hype from the Bruce Lee era. There went the martial arts weapons. A woman can't even legally carry mace or anything that is concealed as a weapon. What is next. Longbows. martial Arts Schools and of course the kitchen knife, but don't carry it or put it under your pillow.

Jim McB
If I was a person from Quebec, and I opposed the dismantling of the long gun registry I would take the following action as I did on the advice of a blogger. Google Marc Lapine Muslim It is a suprising story that will unfold for you, one that the media reported but that we all overlooked. It is germane to this discssion!

Graham
The current long gun registry had NOTHING to do with the recent Toronto Police siezure of 58 firearms. Chief Miller, oops, I mean Chief Blair said as much at his press conference.He stated very clearly that the police had information on 25 firearms this individual had from the old RESTRICTED weapons information system. They were not re registered in the new system. When they arrived, they also found 33 other firearms that had NEVER been registered.So where did the long gun registry help in this case???P.S. - Restricetd and prohibited firearms (handguns, as well as some rifles and shotguns) have had to be registered in Canada since 1934, and will continue to be registered.

Joan
Too bad more time was not spent on getting law abiding citizens their H1N1 shot rather than trying to keep taking shots at the gun registry. If the fee had not been waveried for re-newal of the licence and the registry was actually making money, i wonder what the reason would be for getting rid of it then. The only promise he is trying to keep!!

happy
Wow all you conservative gun-toting rednecks sure sound happy tonight! By scrapping the registry you've just wasted the billions spent to keep it going. Thank you for wasting billions you hillbilly conservatives!

Denis
It's hard to believe what this counry has come to. We have a small step forward for civil liberty and the loony left is moaning like old ladies. How much are they willing to give up to have big brother tuck them in. Let's get tough on crimminals instead of taking peoples privacy away just to feel a little safer, and I do mean feel, the bad guy's will always have their guns.

Kirk
It's about time! The registry was a Liberal knee jerk reaction to appease the lobbyists. This was just one of the several screw ups the Liberals managed to accomplish while they were in power. We need to start prosecuting the criminals harsher who commit violent crimes with firearms and stop harassing the innnocent for owning a hunting rifle.

h yie
Criminals are applauding in the background. Why? They only need to recruit one licensed individual to buy long guns, pay him off, saw it off, and voila. Those guns will never be registered and thus never traceable. Combat violent crimes..... that was the Conservative motto. I wonder how this fits into the agenda.

max
I do not condone the murders of innocent people t schools, on the street, in your house, whether with a gun or not. The registry is a waste of time, money and has not been proven to reduce gun crimes. Gun violence is still on the rise and is due to illegal weapons, most of which are handguns. There is a good handgun (and restricted) gun registry in place. These provide for added responsibilities and restrictions on the owners. The POL and PAL system are in place to check and train those who want to legally use a gun, long gun or not. Very few of the crimnals using guns on the streets of TO or Van are registered (gun owners that is) or are the guns registered. We do have laws inplace for the use of a gun in committing a crime. Now enforce it, do not let it be plea bargained waay. The long gun registry was a farce when it was introduced and with the addition of computer programs, it was 'revamped' into a billion dollar joke. Like all taxes, if they are being properly used, people would see real results and not complain. As for revamping it again, why didn't you keep driving your 1980 Chevettte, sometimes it best to put garbage in the teash. A new registry run simislir to vehicles with the money going directly to policing and gun crime with the crimnals truely penalized would be supported by most, including gun owners

EmmyPankhurst
It;s about time this Liberal white elephant was put to sleep, we have far more important things to be worrying about right now.

JTT
Lets face facts. The gun registry was created for the same reason we had the sponsorship program, the ehealth program, the human resources boondoggle, etc.: so LOTS of money could mysteriously disappear, most likely into the hands of the Liberals at all levels who create such programs.

cantuc
Thank you to the members of parliament that voted to kill this ridiculous knee jerk long gun registry . Now please go after the real criminals .

mark anderson
This is long over due. People who own guns are not criminals and really shouldn't be treated as such. the registry only succeeded in making a list of law abiding citizens, nothing more. now think of all the other uses that wasted 2 billion dollars could have gone to, (health care education)instead of being wasted on a "look like we're doing something so the sheeple can feel safe" project. It seems like a no brainer: criminals don't register the guns they use in crimes and if they stole the gun from a registered owner then the gun is no longer at the registered address. you want to do something about gun violence then why not try something absolutely novel like actually locking up and punishing criminals rather than a stern "don't do that again".

Geoff in Lethbridge
I'd like to know how the police chiefs think having a record in a computer in New Brunswick stops a person from using a gun illegally or forces them to use it legally!I'd also like to know how a record on that computer helps police find the crook that used a stolen gun instead of the person it was stolen from. And how they expect criminals to obey one law set - registering weapons and transporting them - when criminals break so many other laws.